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HelenW Jul 5th 2014

I'm saying nothing. Rob McK? :bigsmile:

Pete T Jul 5th 2014

Done it?

robmck Jul 6th 2014

Why its taken me so long to do this 'iconic' run is a mystery, completely off my radar for 19 years? i enjoyed it immensely (well most of it). All credit to Helen W for suggesting it to me, her turn next!
For the record my time was 6 hours 33 minutes.
I have some times of previous members runs but it is far from complete. If anyone else who has completed the run, could they sent the details to me and i will update the spread sheet. Unless someone has that information already.

y rush Jul 6th 2014

There is a lot of previous runners listed in the 25th anniversary book rob if you remember I sent you the info. Well done on your run

Tim R Jul 7th 2014

Well done Rob!

DaveW Jul 7th 2014

Great Job Rob !!

valdaree Jul 7th 2014

Glad you enjoyed your Bull to Bull Rob. Well done!!! :smile::smile:

john_millen Jul 8th 2014

Well done. What is the route?

HelenW Jul 9th 2014

Nobody tell Millen. I'm going to do it as late in the year as possible in order to wrest that trophy from McKeever via the McIvers.

john_millen Jul 10th 2014

Definitely doing it now.. 31 December on skis :devil:

Petros Jul 11th 2014

31 December won’t do you much good.:sad: The trophy is presented at the Christmas party, which is usually in early December.

robmck Jul 12th 2014

For the benefit of our new members i will write an article on the history of the race and update it with times and those who have done it in recent years for the next newsie. It is a run all members are capable of and is well recommended.

just need the times for Pete t, Mike Mc, Pat Mc, John Parminter,Sue and Will, etc

For those who can't wait that long. The challenge starts at the Black Bull, Coniston and finishes at the 'old' John Bull at Silecroft or vice versa via the Old Man of Coniston, Dow Crag, White Pike, Sticle Pike, Ulpha, Whit Fell, Buckbarrow and Black Combe. Approx 20 miles and 5000 feet. If you are feeling good, you can always to it there and back like Peter G.

Pete T Jul 12th 2014

Hi Rob, 4:07.

And you don't have to go over Dow, you can go around or take a direct route from the Old Man to White Pike.

DaveW Jul 13th 2014

Lets see how many people can do this this year ? ... (even repeats?) .. i've always fancied this ... should have done it a couple of years ago when i was running OK ... maybe a whole bunch of us as a special outing together in ?September ? ??

keith Jul 14th 2014

Keith N

Well done Rob. I will be doing it hopefully sometime this year. In regard to the route taken, if my memory serves me right, from Ulpha the route goes to the Post Office and through Rainsborough Woods, coming out at the Bobbin Mill, then up the road to Bigert Mire. Is this the way you went?

Further to the route description, I still do not know why Caw is not included in the official route.

John P Jul 19th 2014

I did it in 2002 in a time of 5 hrs 31 mins.

Wouldn't mind having another crack at it as I wasn't particularly prepared when I did it.


mj Jul 22nd 2014

I'd love to have a go at this this year too

  Will Jul 22nd 2014

Sue and I weren’t very well prepared either, so we went up Caw and Dow and missed out Stickle Pike. Lovely run, though.

If you time it right you can get the train to Silecroft, run to Coniston, wait in the pub and then get the bus back to Ulverston.

keith Jul 23rd 2014

There would appear to be some differences in the understanding of the route to be taken for the Bull to Bull.

If my memory serves me right the true route is:

The Bull, Silecroft, Black Combe, Whitfell, Bigert Mire, Bobbin Mill, Rainsborough Woods, Ulpha Post Office,
Ulpha Bridge, Stickle Pike, White Pike, White Maiden, Brown Pike, Buck Pike, Dow Crag, Coniston Old Man, The Bull, Coniston.

If reversed the above locations should be reached in reverse order.

Some members may disagree with above but that only confirms my opinion that the exact route should be determined and confirmed by the Committee. That will ensure that future members know exactly effort is required what is required in completing a Bull to Bull.

If the above is discussed by the Committee they should also consider the inclusion of Caw summit in the route as it is a natural extension of the Walna Scar, White Pike, White Maiden, land mass.

The above is my opinion of the route of Bull and in no way is it a criticism of those who have completed, what is a good challenge. Those who have completed It deserve to be recognised and applauded for their efforts.

Keith N

y rush Jul 23rd 2014

I would like to endorse the route Keith has mentioned, having run it myself a good few years ago. Adding Caw would indeed make it slightly longer. It will be
interesting to see what the Committee decides as it stands it's a great test of endurance and at times of navigation when the weather is thick clag as I
experienced a good few years ago. I hope future aspirants enjoy it as much as I did + the beer tastes all the better at the end in Coniston for your efforts

mikemc Jul 23rd 2014


The Bull to Bull began life in the imagination of BCR member John Nixon. He wanted to re-enact Hannibal’s crossing of the Alps, with the Coniston and Corney Fells playing the part of the Alps and himself playing the part of the elephants. He also wanted to raise money for a children’s hospital. So, at 10.30 on 12th June 1988 John set off from the Black Bull in Coniston. His route took him via Coniston Old Man, Dow Crag, White Pike, Kiln Bank Cross, Stickle Pike, Ulpha Post Office, Bigertmire, Whitfell, Buckbarrow and Black Combe to the John Bull at Silecroft.

y rush Jul 23rd 2014

And we re very grateful for the foresight of John Nixon as it is a splendid run to do, in terms of terrain, scenary, flora and fauna and of course the satisfaction of it's completion however fast or slow it is completed :bigsmile:

mj Jul 24th 2015

Hi all, on Sunday I set out to do the Bull to Bull... to Bull, to get some miles in for UTMB. I got out and back in 10:25, plus a 14 minute stop at the Miners Arms for a lemonade and lime and some nuts! Happyto be the second person that I know of to do this.

Any data geeks can have a butchers here: as you can see I made a few nav errors and could have cut the ascent/descent of coniston a bit more fine. The out was more a recce for the way back and I was making good time on the home run until I hit stickle pike and ran low on energy (hadn't eaten enough during the day).

Looking forward to making a proper attempt some time and having a crack at Pete's record, though I'm not yet sure which was would be faster, or if I did beat Pete's time going the other way if this would be valid...

Beth Jul 25th 2015

Hey Mike, awesome running. Looks like you had a bit of fun around Ulpha! Did you find the track through the woods in the end?
When we did it last year we struggled to find the descent off Stickle Pike, got a good route in the end though.
....but we were moving at half the speed you were! ;)

y rush Jul 25th 2015

Well done mj - have a really fab UTMB - acclimatise well and go smash it, be interested to see how you go compared to Mike Berry, have a safe great tour - Bonne Chance!

Petros Jul 26th 2015

My times were:

Whicham to Coniston 5 hours 38 minutes
At Coniston 18 minutes
Coniston to Whicham 5 hours 56 minutes

Total 11 hours 52 minutes

JamesG Aug 2nd 2015

Completed the Bull to Bull with Pete Grayson yesterday 1 Aug 2015. We did all the key points referred to in Mike McIver’s 23.7.14 route summary going past Ulpha post office and through Rainsbarrow Woods and did it just under 6 hours – 5.58 something per Peter. We had a break at Ulpha post office and I hoped we had done all the hard bit by then but the second half is almost harder with a long climb up onto Whitfell and then lots of off track running through tussocky grass until eventually hitting the paths to Black Combe for a smoother finish. Our eventual distance per my Garmin was 21.74 miles. Pete has presumably now done the most B to B’s!

Petros Aug 2nd 2015

James is right, I do now hold the record outright for the most Bull to Bulls, with 4 to Val’s 3. Now that Mike has discovered a ‘double’ as a good training run I expect the record won’t last long.

john_millen Nov 24th 2016

Well done to Julian on his Bull to Bull today. #pothunting

JulianD Nov 24th 2016

An old man, quite dyed in the wool
Finding working exceedingly dull
He fancied a jauntlet
So lifted the gauntlet
And next day he went Bull to Bull

The gauntlet is now thrown firmly back to the floor!

JulianD Nov 24th 2016

Some details:

Black Bull Coniston 08:50
Coniston Old Man 09:48 00:58 00:58
Dow Crag 10:12 01:22 00:24
Brown Pike 10:22 01:32 00:10
White Pike 10:38 01:48 00:16
Caw 11:09 02:19 00:31
Stickle Pike 11:41 02:51 00:32
Ulpha Post Office 12:02 03:12 00:21
Whit Fell 13:15 04:25 01:13
Buckbarrow 13:38 04:48 00:23
Black Combe 14:58 06:08 01:20
The Old John Bull Silecroft 15:28 06:38 00:30

Really slow but honestly the toughest thing I have done for ages. I know that Dow Crag, Buck Pike, Brown Pike and Caw aren't on the official route but I thought I might as well since I was passing. Such a bright clear day that I decided to make the most of it. Very cold on the tops and icy on Coniston Old Man, Dow Crag and down to White Pike but otherwise great conditions. Views were stunning in all directions.

Beth Nov 25th 2016

Brilliant!! Well done Julian!! :)

JamesG Nov 26th 2016

Well done Julian. It seems this was a Bull to Bull plus! That last bit over the rough ground before Black Combe, when you think you are nearly there, is the killer. I will dust down the trophy and hand it over on Saturday if you are coming.

JulianD Nov 30th 2016

Thanks James - you are right about the rough ground before you get to the path going up Black Combe and the climb up Whit Fell seems harder than it should too! Sorry to say that we will be away visiting family in Spain this weekend and will miss the Christmas do.

Rookie Apr 3rd 2017

First attempt of 2017 from James Harris? I say attempt since he didn't actually go to the John Bull ... maybe he was late for his train.

Pup Harris Apr 4th 2017

haha no I wasn't late for my train! I'd cycled to Coniston to do the Kong Mini Mountain Marathon and it was a bit of a last minute decision to do the B2B (hence googling the remaining tops on Whitfell and double-checking location of the pub). I just assumed the Bull pub had changed its name to Miners Arms - whoops!

Rookie May 3rd 2017

Rob and Lizzie

john_millen May 13th 2017

A hastily (poorly) arranged 5:25 B2B today.

Highlights include bluebells in the woods on the way to the Ulpha Post Office.
3 Cuckoos.
Lots of lambs.
Beer at the Red Lion.

Great route, hit most of the checkpoints. Claggy start but got better as I got slower. Splits/route on Strava. Missed the bus so walked back to Lowick from Coniston.

Beth May 14th 2017

2017 is the year of the Bull it seems!!
Surely somebody is going to bag Pete's record this season....?!

Pete T May 15th 2017

It'd be a doddle for certain members of the club...

Pete T May 21st 2017

Saw Harv near Kiln Bank Cross this lunchtime, cruising his way to a fast Bull to Bull, only managed to delay him 30 seconds or so....:bigsmile:

harv May 21st 2017

Yep, did it. Set off in the clag for first few tops, but it had cleared by white pike revealing the remaining route. Then it just got brighter. Loads of bcrs out doing secret training. Busted. Satisfying route. Missed my train tho, as I'd heard it would be "a doddle" (it wasn't) so thought I'd get round in under 4 hours (I didn't). John picked me up from the miners.

Old man 40 (40)
Dow 54 (14)
White pike 1:09 (15)
Caw 1:28 (19)
Stickle pike 1:50 (22)
Ulpha bridge 2:01 (11)
Whitfell 2:42 (41)
Buckbarrow 2:56 (14)
Road 3:04 (8)
Black Combe 3:49 (45)
OJB 4:04 (15)

Lost time goin up Black Combe. Tried to take a direct line. Swampy, and lost height.
Anyway, hugely enjoyable afternoon out. :bigsmile:

harv May 21st 2017

The allure of a sub 4 bull2bull remains...:wink:

Pete T May 21st 2017

Well done Harv, you looked comfortable when we saw you. Very polite to leave the 4 hour challenge going.

annalup May 21st 2017

Nice one Harv!

Pete T May 22nd 2017

Just worked it out Harv, you didn't need to go up Caw, that would probably save 10 minutes.

harv May 22nd 2017

Didn't think it'd be that much quicker goin round, and it felt right. I was full of beans at that point. Not so much on the climb up Black Combe...
Is there an "official" route? I tried to visit the points others had.
Only visited the Duddon checkpoint of Dow crag as well, not the proper top. Julian's route looked good. I might do it again once the Lakeland classics are over.

Pete T May 23rd 2017

Harv, the original route run by John Nixon is further up this string (and doesn't include Caw), see the posts by Keith and Mikemc from July 2014. I'm not sure when but the accepted route became just the peaks, but not including Dow or Caw - this was the route completed by most BCRs over the years, I used to have something from John Peel and Mike Berry about this but can't find it now. A year or so ago when this came up, the committee talked about it and decided it should be the original route - so that's the current position......

harv May 23rd 2017

1Black bull
2Old man
3White pike
4Stickle pike
5Ulpha bridge( then through rainsborrow woods behind post office and past biggert mire)
8Black Combe
9Old John Bull

That it?

harv May 23rd 2017

Dow crag was also listed in John N's original route. Are we saying the official Dow summit is included? If so, my run was void. That's alright though. I'll have to go again! Sorry to be pedantic, I know it's all good fun...